MN Rube Chat

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:22 pm

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:20 pm

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:13 pm

Brooklyn isn't getting the players back in this trade because their cap space is exhausted by the two FA signings. They would be going to the 3rd team, which can just absorb the outgoing MN players into their cap space. The Canis example used the Knicks, presuming they would get shut out in FA.

Since they would need to get to salary floor anyway at this point, they're taking Teague without any long term salary commitment (like Phi did with Redick as a free agent), so they only need very little incentive for it to make sense for them. That's why you could get by with Okogie and not have to give up Culver.

Brooklyn isn't expected to get anything of value in return for Russell since the cap space is what they want, so we don't have to actually match on the court talent to Russell. We only have to send out enough for an unrelated team to take on Teague for 1 year.

The Nets will not take salary back in any sign and trade.

that's what I said. The Knicks are taking the salary back in this case.

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:44 pm

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:22 pm

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:20 pm

The Nets will not take salary back in any sign and trade.

that's what I said. The Knicks are taking the salary back in this case.

Knicks don’t want salary either.

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:46 pm

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:44 pm

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:22 pm

that's what I said. The Knicks are taking the salary back in this case.

Knicks don’t want salary either.

This was an example brought up by Canis, would be under the presumption that the Knicks get shut out in FA.
The Knicks could be replaced though by any random team with cap space.

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:46 pm

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:44 pm

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:22 pm

that's what I said. The Knicks are taking the salary back in this case.

Knicks don’t want salary either.

This was an example brought up by Canis, would be under the presumption that the Knicks get shut out in FA.
The Knicks could be replaced though by any random team with cap space.

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:50 pm

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:46 pm

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:44 pm

Knicks don’t want salary either.

This was an example brought up by Canis, would be under the presumption that the Knicks get shut out in FA.
The Knicks could be replaced though by any random team with cap space.

If the Wolves has cap space, what would you want for about $30 million? Remember these are t just numbers on pages, but real dollars you have to fork over?

digitalwolf wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:51 pm

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:46 pm

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:44 pm

Knicks don’t want salary either.

This was an example brought up by Canis, would be under the presumption that the Knicks get shut out in FA.
The Knicks could be replaced though by any random team with cap space.

The Knicks don't want salary per say, but they also just don't want Knox and Barrett as their best two players. This is arguably the biggest FA crop since...2010? They got Amare then....this offseason, I don't even see that level of garbage being interested. Unless they are planning to go Philly mode, they are going to take a gamble on someone. It's Jimmy fucking Dolan.

digitalwolf wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:51 pm

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:46 pm

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:44 pm

Knicks don’t want salary either.

This was an example brought up by Canis, would be under the presumption that the Knicks get shut out in FA.
The Knicks could be replaced though by any random team with cap space.

The Knicks don't want salary per say, but they also just don't want Knox and Barrett as their best two players. This is arguably the biggest FA crop since...2010? They got Amare then....this offseason, I don't even see that level of garbage being interested. Unless they are planning to go Philly mode, they are going to take a gamble on someone. It's Jimmy fucking Dolan.

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:57 pm

digitalwolf wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:51 pm

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:46 pm

This was an example brought up by Canis, would be under the presumption that the Knicks get shut out in FA.
The Knicks could be replaced though by any random team with cap space.

The Knicks don't want salary per say, but they also just don't want Knox and Barrett as their best two players. This is arguably the biggest FA crop since...2010? They got Amare then....this offseason, I don't even see that level of garbage being interested. Unless they are planning to go Philly mode, they are going to take a gamble on someone. It's Jimmy fucking Dolan.

I do agree, but there's not any assurance that anyone of substance is going to reciprocate based on how lousy the org is. That's why I said this example would only work in the event that the Knicks are shut out in FA and have to roll their cap over to next year.
That's why I also said though that this example could still hold on any other team that has cap space. Any team that needs to make some acquisition just to get closer to the floor would be happy to get Okogie for free just for taking on Teague.

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:54 pm

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:50 pm

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:46 pm

This was an example brought up by Canis, would be under the presumption that the Knicks get shut out in FA.
The Knicks could be replaced though by any random team with cap space.

If the Wolves has cap space, what would you want for about $30 million? Remember these are t just numbers on pages, but real dollars you have to fork over?

I don't understand your point. This would be under the presumption that they wanted to sign Russell anyway, if they don't then this whole conversation is moot.
But I'm not really interested in getting pulled into one of your philosophical debates about what "value" really is, so unless you're interested in talking about what players/other assets you'd be willing to trade in order to make this deal work, then I'm not interested in responding to you anymore.

Sorry.

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 5:39 pm

Oriole81 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:54 pm

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:50 pm

If the Wolves has cap space, what would you want for about $30 million? Remember these are t just numbers on pages, but real dollars you have to fork over?

I don't understand your point. This would be under the presumption that they wanted to sign Russell anyway, if they don't then this whole conversation is moot.
But I'm not really interested in getting pulled into one of your philosophical debates about what "value" really is, so unless you're interested in talking about what players/other assets you'd be willing to trade in order to make this deal work, then I'm not interested in responding to you anymore.

Sorry.

Here is the point that most overlook in these trade ideas:

If you were the owner/GM of the 3rd party team that is absorbing $30 million in salary, what would YOU want to make that deal? Remember, it isn't a "cap number" or some hypothetical. It is $30 million in cash you have to pay out so that two OTHER teams can improve their team.

You can buy a 2nd round pick for about $1.5 million, so these fantasies you can unload a contract like Teague's $19 million by attaching some future 2nd is absurd.

Thrillkill wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 5:51 pm Oh, and not to mention you can add cash. So a team ca actually make money on a deal taking on Teague. Plus Teague is good.

jodaman01 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:05 pm This is why they should have just took Coby White. He would have been an upgrade at PG, and the entire fanbase would be hacked up right now for the change.

Nobody really believes that Russell is worth giving up every last resource we have or giving away Wiggins for absolutely nothing.....and it still likely won’t be enough because other teams have more to offer. Once the players left on the team find out they were in a failed offer - good luck getting them to give a rat’s ass next season until you are able to trade them (just think Lakers failing to get Davis)

Hopefully has a “Plan B” besides Russell that he can realistically close the deal on.

GO WOLVES!!

mglviks wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:40 pm

jodaman01 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:05 pm This is why they should have just took Coby White. He would have been an upgrade at PG, and the entire fanbase would be hacked up right now for the change.

Nobody really believes that Russell is worth giving up every last resource we have or giving away Wiggins for absolutely nothing.....and it still likely won’t be enough because other teams have more to offer. Once the players left on the team find out they were in a failed offer - good luck getting them to give a rat’s ass next season until you are able to trade them (just think Lakers failing to get Davis)

Hopefully has a “Plan B” besides Russell that he can realistically close the deal on.

GO WOLVES!!

I actually agree with this.

I do hate thought of mortgaging everything out, giving up a future picks(when next years draft is better than this years and stocked w pgs), losing Okie or Culver. Or worse yet RoCo(which I doubt or we go get #4).

Same with Wiggins, yes worst contract in the league and disappointed with how he hasnt nor ever will be a superstar or even a star. But he still is a talented volume scorer. Dont want to give him away for nothing or give assests to lose him. Which likely would happen with such a negative contract. He still has use and on some teams like the Kings should actually have value as just a microwave scorer.

Dlo is a good player nd young could get better. But not sold he is the answer or will catapult us into a top 5 in west team. Especially considering having to gut our team just for a chance.

I do believe that Rosas will be careful and wait a couple days into FA as he would have to or the other teams who lose out on FAs would be willing to do our trades, but would have a deal in place or agreed upon prior to the gutting of our team.

I dont require Rosas to fix our team in 2 months into the job. Yes would like improvement, yes want to see growth, es want KAT to not just want to leave the moment he can, so yes we need to be playoff bound sooner than later, but I am rational enough to believe in a process. It unrealist to nelieve magic will happen all at once.

Really 1 more good tank year could do wonders going forward.

mglviks wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:40 pm

jodaman01 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:05 pm This is why they should have just took Coby White. He would have been an upgrade at PG, and the entire fanbase would be hacked up right now for the change.

Nobody really believes that Russell is worth giving up every last resource we have or giving away Wiggins for absolutely nothing.....and it still likely won’t be enough because other teams have more to offer. Once the players left on the team find out they were in a failed offer - good luck getting them to give a rat’s ass next season until you are able to trade them (just think Lakers failing to get Davis)

Hopefully has a “Plan B” besides Russell that he can realistically close the deal on.

GO WOLVES!!

I actually agree with this.

I do hate thought of mortgaging everything out, giving up a future picks(when next years draft is better than this years and stocked w pgs), losing Okie or Culver. Or worse yet RoCo(which I doubt or we go get #4).

Same with Wiggins, yes worst contract in the league and disappointed with how he hasnt nor ever will be a superstar or even a star. But he still is a talented volume scorer. Dont want to give him away for nothing or give assests to lose him. Which likely would happen with such a negative contract. He still has use and on some teams like the Kings should actually have value as just a microwave scorer.

Dlo is a good player nd young could get better. But not sold he is the answer or will catapult us into a top 5 in west team. Especially considering having to gut our team just for a chance.

I do believe that Rosas will be careful and wait a couple days into FA as he would have to or the other teams who lose out on FAs would be willing to do our trades, but would have a deal in place or agreed upon prior to the gutting of our team.

I dont require Rosas to fix our team in 2 months into the job. Yes would like improvement, yes want to see growth, es want KAT to not just want to leave the moment he can, so yes we need to be playoff bound sooner than later, but I am rational enough to believe in a process. It unrealist to nelieve magic will happen all at once.

Really 1 more good tank year could do wonders going forward.

jodaman01 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:05 pm This is why they should have just took Coby White. He would have been an upgrade at PG, and the entire fanbase would be hacked up right now for the change.

Nobody really believes that Russell is worth giving up every last resource we have or giving away Wiggins for absolutely nothing.....and it still likely won’t be enough because other teams have more to offer. Once the players left on the team find out they were in a failed offer - good luck getting them to give a rat’s ass next season until you are able to trade them (just think Lakers failing to get Davis)

Hopefully has a “Plan B” besides Russell that he can realistically close the deal on.

GO WOLVES!!

T_J wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:43 pm

mglviks wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:40 pm

jodaman01 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:05 pm This is why they should have just took Coby White. He would have been an upgrade at PG, and the entire fanbase would be hacked up right now for the change.

Nobody really believes that Russell is worth giving up every last resource we have or giving away Wiggins for absolutely nothing.....and it still likely won’t be enough because other teams have more to offer. Once the players left on the team find out they were in a failed offer - good luck getting them to give a rat’s ass next season until you are able to trade them (just think Lakers failing to get Davis)

Hopefully has a “Plan B” besides Russell that he can realistically close the deal on.

GO WOLVES!!

I actually agree with this.

I do hate thought of mortgaging everything out, giving up a future picks(when next years draft is better than this years and stocked w pgs), losing Okie or Culver. Or worse yet RoCo(which I doubt or we go get #4).

Same with Wiggins, yes worst contract in the league and disappointed with how he hasnt nor ever will be a superstar or even a star. But he still is a talented volume scorer. Dont want to give him away for nothing or give assests to lose him. Which likely would happen with such a negative contract. He still has use and on some teams like the Kings should actually have value as just a microwave scorer.

Dlo is a good player nd young could get better. But not sold he is the answer or will catapult us into a top 5 in west team. Especially considering having to gut our team just for a chance.

I do believe that Rosas will be careful and wait a couple days into FA as he would have to or the other teams who lose out on FAs would be willing to do our trades, but would have a deal in place or agreed upon prior to the gutting of our team.

I dont require Rosas to fix our team in 2 months into the job. Yes would like improvement, yes want to see growth, es want KAT to not just want to leave the moment he can, so yes we need to be playoff bound sooner than later, but I am rational enough to believe in a process. It unrealist to nelieve magic will happen all at once.

Really 1 more good tank year could do wonders going forward.

Towns and parts are too good to tank. This is a 35 win roster as is. I assume it'll be tweaked and 40 wins is doable easily.

Small Hands wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:00 pm

T_J wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:43 pm

mglviks wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:40 pm

I actually agree with this.

I do hate thought of mortgaging everything out, giving up a future picks(when next years draft is better than this years and stocked w pgs), losing Okie or Culver. Or worse yet RoCo(which I doubt or we go get #4).

Same with Wiggins, yes worst contract in the league and disappointed with how he hasnt nor ever will be a superstar or even a star. But he still is a talented volume scorer. Dont want to give him away for nothing or give assests to lose him. Which likely would happen with such a negative contract. He still has use and on some teams like the Kings should actually have value as just a microwave scorer.

Dlo is a good player nd young could get better. But not sold he is the answer or will catapult us into a top 5 in west team. Especially considering having to gut our team just for a chance.

I do believe that Rosas will be careful and wait a couple days into FA as he would have to or the other teams who lose out on FAs would be willing to do our trades, but would have a deal in place or agreed upon prior to the gutting of our team.

I dont require Rosas to fix our team in 2 months into the job. Yes would like improvement, yes want to see growth, es want KAT to not just want to leave the moment he can, so yes we need to be playoff bound sooner than later, but I am rational enough to believe in a process. It unrealist to nelieve magic will happen all at once.

Really 1 more good tank year could do wonders going forward.

Towns and parts are too good to tank. This is a 35 win roster as is. I assume it'll be tweaked and 40 wins is doable easily.

40 wins is NBA purgatory. Not good enough to make the playoffs. Not bad enough to get a decent pick.

They need to bottom out again, and hope they hit a home run in the draft. It's the only way. Butler ruined this squad. Blow the fucker up.

Small Hands wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:00 pm

T_J wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:43 pm

mglviks wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:40 pm

I actually agree with this.

I do hate thought of mortgaging everything out, giving up a future picks(when next years draft is better than this years and stocked w pgs), losing Okie or Culver. Or worse yet RoCo(which I doubt or we go get #4).

Same with Wiggins, yes worst contract in the league and disappointed with how he hasnt nor ever will be a superstar or even a star. But he still is a talented volume scorer. Dont want to give him away for nothing or give assests to lose him. Which likely would happen with such a negative contract. He still has use and on some teams like the Kings should actually have value as just a microwave scorer.

Dlo is a good player nd young could get better. But not sold he is the answer or will catapult us into a top 5 in west team. Especially considering having to gut our team just for a chance.

I do believe that Rosas will be careful and wait a couple days into FA as he would have to or the other teams who lose out on FAs would be willing to do our trades, but would have a deal in place or agreed upon prior to the gutting of our team.

I dont require Rosas to fix our team in 2 months into the job. Yes would like improvement, yes want to see growth, es want KAT to not just want to leave the moment he can, so yes we need to be playoff bound sooner than later, but I am rational enough to believe in a process. It unrealist to nelieve magic will happen all at once.

Really 1 more good tank year could do wonders going forward.

Towns and parts are too good to tank. This is a 35 win roster as is. I assume it'll be tweaked and 40 wins is doable easily.

40 wins is NBA purgatory. Not good enough to make the playoffs. Not bad enough to get a decent pick.

They need to bottom out again, and hope they hit a home run in the draft. It's the only way. Butler ruined this squad. Blow the fucker up.

Small Hands wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:00 pm

T_J wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:43 pm

mglviks wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:40 pm

I actually agree with this.

I do hate thought of mortgaging everything out, giving up a future picks(when next years draft is better than this years and stocked w pgs), losing Okie or Culver. Or worse yet RoCo(which I doubt or we go get #4).

Same with Wiggins, yes worst contract in the league and disappointed with how he hasnt nor ever will be a superstar or even a star. But he still is a talented volume scorer. Dont want to give him away for nothing or give assests to lose him. Which likely would happen with such a negative contract. He still has use and on some teams like the Kings should actually have value as just a microwave scorer.

Dlo is a good player nd young could get better. But not sold he is the answer or will catapult us into a top 5 in west team. Especially considering having to gut our team just for a chance.

I do believe that Rosas will be careful and wait a couple days into FA as he would have to or the other teams who lose out on FAs would be willing to do our trades, but would have a deal in place or agreed upon prior to the gutting of our team.

I dont require Rosas to fix our team in 2 months into the job. Yes would like improvement, yes want to see growth, es want KAT to not just want to leave the moment he can, so yes we need to be playoff bound sooner than later, but I am rational enough to believe in a process. It unrealist to nelieve magic will happen all at once.

Really 1 more good tank year could do wonders going forward.

Towns and parts are too good to tank. This is a 35 win roster as is. I assume it'll be tweaked and 40 wins is doable easily.

40 wins is NBA purgatory. Not good enough to make the playoffs. Not bad enough to get a decent pick.

They need to bottom out again, and hope they hit a home run in the draft. It's the only way. Butler ruined this squad. Blow the fucker up.

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:51 pm

jodaman01 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:05 pm This is why they should have just took Coby White. He would have been an upgrade at PG, and the entire fanbase would be hacked up right now for the change.

Nobody really believes that Russell is worth giving up every last resource we have or giving away Wiggins for absolutely nothing.....and it still likely won’t be enough because other teams have more to offer. Once the players left on the team find out they were in a failed offer - good luck getting them to give a rat’s ass next season until you are able to trade them (just think Lakers failing to get Davis)

Hopefully has a “Plan B” besides Russell that he can realistically close the deal on.

GO WOLVES!!

Colby White was one of the best catch and shoot players in the draft. He should have been the pick at 6.

jodaman01 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 10:34 pm

mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:51 pm

jodaman01 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:05 pm This is why they should have just took Coby White. He would have been an upgrade at PG, and the entire fanbase would be hacked up right now for the change.

Nobody really believes that Russell is worth giving up every last resource we have or giving away Wiggins for absolutely nothing.....and it still likely won’t be enough because other teams have more to offer. Once the players left on the team find out they were in a failed offer - good luck getting them to give a rat’s ass next season until you are able to trade them (just think Lakers failing to get Davis)

Hopefully has a “Plan B” besides Russell that he can realistically close the deal on.

GO WOLVES!!

Colby White was one of the best catch and shoot players in the draft. He should have been the pick at 6.

They say he is a lot like the Fox kid with Kings. Very very fast from end to end with the ball, add in the catch and shoot and that would have been good enough for me. (Even if Rosas ranked him Tier 2. Hell he had to be right at the front of Rosas’s Tier 2 list. I wonder what the drop off from the player he had last in Tier 1 was to the first player he had in Tier 2 - I think that is a just bullshit out of Rosas anyway). I just find it incredible how every year in every draft the Wolves have been in, we always read how they got exactly who they targeted and were lucky to get in every article following those drafts.

Now the Wolves are going to have to make a bad deal IMO just to try and get Russell. I like him, but adding him here to a gutted roster I just don’t see where it really moves the needle - it likely ends up creating more needs and moving us backwards.

I would be excited if we got him, but these options being discussed or guessed at just seem to be getting worse with each new team that shows interest in the guy.

GO WOLVES!!

digitalwolf wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 11:58 pm Most of everyone here, including myself would have preferred Garland but taken White without issue. But the Wolves worked him out.....they clearly didn't love all that they saw....and on top of that, if Dlo is real, then drafting a future PG isn't a need. If we land Dlo, the pick is awesome....if we don't, and Culver shows out, it's fine. If he sucks and no Dlo, than it looks bad. It's that simple.